Lost Season 4 Discussion

[Theresa]

I thought it would be nice to have a thread to discuss the episodes as we see them. So if you havent seen them, of course dont visit this thread!

Season 4, Episode 1: The Beginning of the End
Original Air Date: 31 January 2008
Charlie's dying message casts doubt on the intentions of the people that Jack believes to be their rescuers. A power struggle ensues between Jack, who wants to leave the island, and Locke, who thinks that they're supposed to stay.

Thoughts and feelings?
-The way each member took the death. Sayid looking away, Jack looking down, Claire fighting back the tears. Very well done!
-Hurley charlie encounter-very surreal. Charlies words ring in my mind "they need you" (hence my sig)
-Naomi (i think?)- I dont trust her...she sounds legit but nothing is ever right on the island.
-Hurleys speech very touching. Esp the flash to charlie with "not penny's boat" on his hand.
However I wanted more Sawyer in the episode. All in all very good start!

[TwoTreeHills]

Gonna watch the 1st and 2nd epi today! Excited :)

[Steph]

yay now you can catch up :)

[TwoTreeHills]

I'm glad I did! ;) ^^

Anyways, did anyone think that the 2nd episode was better than the premiere? I thought both were amazing, but the 2nd one was more captivating.

4.01 The Beginning of the End: I thought it was good. Not par up to the S3 finale, but it was def. good. I feel for Hurley though :( Definitely interesting how all of the survivors have divided into different assumptions. And I really like how we're getting flash forwards and not flashbacks! I think the ending made the episode spice up a bit because it leaves you wanting more.

4.02 Confirmed Dead: I definitely enjoyed this episode fully. It was exciting from beginning to end. I was glad we got some answers and information on who those 4 "Rescuers" where and what they wanted (Thank you very much, Ben). Those flashforwards really grab your attention cause you keep asking yourselves how the get there and saying why one choice is the wrong one (Desmond or Jack, Jack/Hurley flashforward etc.). Brings you a lot of questions left to answer (typical Lost move lol). Anyways, amazing episode I'm back with this show and I am so happy bout it!

[love-dom-monaghan]

both episode have now left me with some many new questions that i feel like my brain will explode :lol:

those new people, i don't like or trust! Dan, who i thought looked creepy..is the nicest out of them all :lol: well so far
okay best moment, was Jack all like "my friends are pointing guns at you right now" and them bam! out comes Sayid and Juliet guns a blazing!
i love love loved Jack with his woman scene when Kate's like "why couldn't you warn me the cavalary was coming"
"i uhh..gave you the wink" :lol: LMAO!! oh Jack, you silly!
and then of course i love Sawyer's new nicknames for people..i LOLed when he called Ben "Yoda"
i loved this part with him bcuz he sounded so serious when he said this to locke
Locke: I saw Walt. He was bigger.
Sawyer: What? Like a giant?

i still miss my Charlie, tonight was the first time Dom wasn't in the credits :( and also there wasn't enough Claire, as usual! grr..but oh well whatcha gunna do..still liked the episode and i'm still as confused as ever! :lol:

[teamluke]

Thanks for creating this thread. I'm usually a lurker, but I'm gonna try to keep up with this. I noticed that there were specific actor/character threads, but I didn't know where to post my speculations/questions. I hope this will be the right place. I'm trying so hard to stay spoiler free (but with Lost, it's always so hard, you just wanna know more and more AND MORE).

It's funny, during the actual episodes I have so many questions. The show ends, and then I forget most of them. Like trying to recount the premiere is so hard. Of course the main question is left though: Who are the Oceanic Six? Who gets off? We know 3/6, but who could the other six be? It keeps coming back to that. And I truly think there will be couples that are ripped, or duos we're used to seeing that will broken apart. Like, for instance, if Jin gets off, Sun won't. If Bernard is off, Rose won't be. Or, that some of the people who get off, are people who didn't REALLY want to, like Locke. I like the irony in that. Locke would go crazy with wanting to go back for selfish reasonings, very unlike Hurley/Jack. But wouldn't it be an interesting turn of events for Jack/Hurley, in a flashforward to visit Locke? Knowing of the 3 of them, he really had the greatest connection to the island (even if he seems a bit mad sometimes)? I think it would make sense that Desmond get off. But as he has the most to gain, I doubt he will. However, it would introduce a lot more characters, and we'd get to see characters like Penny, and papa Widmore again, which would be cool. I want/wish Sawyer to get off, because of his daughter especially--- but there's no way they'd have Jack, Kate AND Sawyer off the island. It'd make the island viewing vapid to watch. lol. .... I want Claire and Aaron to get off, because of Charlie, of course.

The questions with the second episode are more simple:
-why did Naomi ask Matthew (that tall black man) what if she were to find survivors of Oceanic 815? Like why was that even a thought? And why was that man so sure she wouldn't?
-when was that picture taken of Ben? I don't really remember it, but I didn't think he was wearing glasses, someone correct me if I'm wrong. Is the reason that the island didn't heal Ben because he played on the fence? He preached to others about what you're supposed to do, how you're supposed to be, wanted their trust, and everything, and not only did he lie about stuff, he also visited, and communicated with the outside world. I'm assuming he visited the real world. And why? Was this just before the purge? Was it apart of making the Dharma's believe that he was in charge, had granted status from workman to above all somehow? Thus allowing him to communicate with them, and make them believe nothing was wrong at the island (where he killed everyone?).
-how did that polar bear get to that place off the island? Are there other stations off the island? I always thought of Portland (or whatever) as the "headquarters". But are there other places? If SO, why do they have the same names? (Someone said it was a hydra symbol on it.)
-did Dharma bring the polar bears there, or where they already there? If they brought them there, why polar bears? Why did they wanna do tests on them? How can they live in a climate that is so different from what they're used to?

What's everyone else thinking about?

[Ryanlicious]

My gosh, I can't even respond to your post team luke. I am not spoiler free, so I don't want to give to anything away. I would love for Sawyer to reconnect with his child & Cassidy. I think that they really loved each other, for as much as Sawyer was able to love. :(

Anyways, welcome to the thread.

[teamluke]

By being a spoiler junkie I completely ruined the finale for me last season, so I have sworn off (well, of Lost spoilers anyway, can't say the same for the rest of my shows...). I know that some spoilers know the 6. That kinda sucks.

Is it considered spoiler to know about who's "episode" is next? Like if we're gonna see flashforwards/flashbacks yet? I wouldn't think that would be a spoiler unless it's of someone we haven't seen for a while, or something.

Thanks for the welcoming. I so need a place to talk about theories, speculation that is spoilerfree!

[Theresa]

Thanks for creating this thread. I'm usually a lurker, but I'm gonna try to keep up with this. I noticed that there were specific actor/character threads, but I didn't know where to post my speculations/questions. I hope this will be the right place. I'm trying so hard to stay spoiler free (but with Lost, it's always so hard, you just wanna know more and more AND MORE).

It's funny, during the actual episodes I have so many questions. The show ends, and then I forget most of them. Like trying to recount the premiere is so hard. Of course the main question is left though: Who are the Oceanic Six? Who gets off? We know 3/6, but who could the other six be? It keeps coming back to that. And I truly think there will be couples that are ripped, or duos we're used to seeing that will broken apart. Like, for instance, if Jin gets off, Sun won't. If Bernard is off, Rose won't be. Or, that some of the people who get off, are people who didn't REALLY want to, like Locke. I like the irony in that. Locke would go crazy with wanting to go back for selfish reasonings, very unlike Hurley/Jack. But wouldn't it be an interesting turn of events for Jack/Hurley, in a flashforward to visit Locke? Knowing of the 3 of them, he really had the greatest connection to the island (even if he seems a bit mad sometimes)? I think it would make sense that Desmond get off. But as he has the most to gain, I doubt he will. However, it would introduce a lot more characters, and we'd get to see characters like Penny, and papa Widmore again, which would be cool. I want/wish Sawyer to get off, because of his daughter especially--- but there's no way they'd have Jack, Kate AND Sawyer off the island. It'd make the island viewing vapid to watch. lol. .... I want Claire and Aaron to get off, because of Charlie, of course.

The questions with the second episode are more simple:
-why did Naomi ask Matthew (that tall black man) what if she were to find survivors of Oceanic 815? Like why was that even a thought? And why was that man so sure she wouldn't?
-when was that picture taken of Ben? I don't really remember it, but I didn't think he was wearing glasses, someone correct me if I'm wrong. Is the reason that the island didn't heal Ben because he played on the fence? He preached to others about what you're supposed to do, how you're supposed to be, wanted their trust, and everything, and not only did he lie about stuff, he also visited, and communicated with the outside world. I'm assuming he visited the real world. And why? Was this just before the purge? Was it apart of making the Dharma's believe that he was in charge, had granted status from workman to above all somehow? Thus allowing him to communicate with them, and make them believe nothing was wrong at the island (where he killed everyone?).
-how did that polar bear get to that place off the island? Are there other stations off the island? I always thought of Portland (or whatever) as the "headquarters". But are there other places? If SO, why do they have the same names? (Someone said it was a hydra symbol on it.)
-did Dharma bring the polar bears there, or where they already there? If they brought them there, why polar bears? Why did they wanna do tests on them? How can they live in a climate that is so different from what they're used to?

What's everyone else thinking about?


Hey there, welcome Im theresa :) Whats your name?
You raised some really GOOD questions and i will comment on them but first wanted to comment on episode 2. :D

Ep 2: Confirmed Dead
Im really intrigued to these 4 people. They all seem to have interesting back stories. I particularly like Miles. Hes one of my favourite asian actors anyway so it was great to see him :)
I loved how Sawyer said to Carl "hes just pushing your buttons" (about ben). showed a more protective side to him. And i totally saw it coming when he punched Ben.
Jack's wink was hilarious. I loved the line he had...
Miles: How stupid do you think I am?
BANG BANG
Jack: I dunno, how stupid are you miles?
ROFL!
Amazing episode though. :D

Now your questions..I was curious who would get off too. I mean it seems almost selfish if someone like Jack and Kate get off but Sawyer has to stay or whatever? And I do agree i think they all need to be on this island, it gave them all an escape so would they want to go back to their lives? Would they stay in touch? (somehow?)

As for the second episode, these four people...can we trust them? what do they want with Ben? And Ben says he had an inside man on their boat, does he mean Michael?

[love-dom-monaghan]

:shocked: OMG you could totally be right...maybe he does mean Michael!!

[Theresa]

lol you didnt think of that Michelle? Gosh i hope im right :lol:

[love-dom-monaghan]

:lol: well i generally don't like to think of Michael's cuz i dispise him so much!

[teamluke]

Thanks for the welcoming, Theresa! My name is Faith.

It's not that I think it's selfish of Kate/Jack to leave Sawyer behind (if that's what essentially happens, as in they don't go back for him), I just think the writers wouldn't do it. I think a lot of people are invested in the triangle, and who's it gonna be, and if Sawyer's off the island, and so's Jack, and Kate isn't with either of them? At least, at the very least I mean, if Sawyer is still on the island, Skaters can credit Kate's being with someone else, to THAT fact.

Not that it's all about ships, and stuff, but it's partially there. I mean, some characters are generally more liked than others, it's a fact, right? And they're not gonna have the more likeable characters off the island, while the rest stay, or visa versa. They're gonna have twists. I'm surprised both Jack/Kate get off the island, honestly. I thought it would be like Kate never gets off, and Sawyer, and Jack can't deal, or the other way around. It seems like it would always be tied to that. But, I would be sincerely surprised if Sawyer gets off (and that's not because I don't want him to, because I definately, definately do).

Did anyone every watch the show The Nine? It was very short lived, and I believe it was on the air either last fall, or the one prior (can't remember which). I think it got canned, but that isn't the point. I was enticed (initially) because of that interaction with characters, it was more about the aftermath (if I'm remembering correctly). People all say that Lost wouldn't be Lost without the island element, but I SOOOo disagree. I think the flashFORWARDS, and getting off the island are AWESOME. I like trying to figure out who people would be once they get off the island. Like the whole experience has to have changed them. And then also you add the fact that not everyone got off, AND they're feeling guilt because of it? AND they've had to lie to the media. But would they stay in connect? When Hurley greets Jack, doesn't it seem like Jack/Hurley haven't exactly been keeping in touch by the way Hurley asks why he's even there? That's how it felt to me.

Ugh. It'll be hard to see Michael again, and how THAT went down (if he is Ben's man on the boat). Does that mean that Ben let him go, knowing that he would bump into these people at some point? And it's been a while, weeks in between Micheal/Walt leaving, and these boat people, so obviously Micheal went back to civilization, right? Or "the real world", however you wanna say it. I wonder if the deal was that Walt got to be safe, so Micheal set him up with somebody, and he can communicate with him, but he has to do some work for Ben for a while, or something.

Micheal was awesome, I mean, what he did for Walt, and how he strived, and that's LOVE. Right? But you think of the chain of events. How Micheal killed LIBBY, ANA LUCIA. He KILLED them. And when are they gonna get to Libby? I always wonder why she was in that psych. ward too. What was her problem? It wouldn't been cool if she wasn't REALLY dead, and that she was the "MAN" on the boat, right? I just would find it cool if she had more "ties" because she also is part of the way Desmond got to the island, and she witnessed Hurley's number freakout stuff.

I PEEKED at which character which episodes are centric, but now I've forgotten. Is this information considered spoiler? If it's a flashforward/flashback that might be spoiler, but is it spoiler if we just knew who it was gonna be about?

And previews, normal previews (not clips) considered spoilers? I'm thinking not, because everyone can see them right? We should be able to discuss them?

[Theresa]

Hey Faith, no problem I love meeting lost fans hehe!

So far we've only seen jack,kate and hurley in the flashforwards (correct me if im wrong) so i guess we'll have to wait and see who else will be there, which will give us a better idea to who got off the island, although im sure most of them will. Some characters I do wonder, will they want to go back? Locke is the most faith driven person and so many things he accounts the island for, so would he want to go back to his boring life? :lol:

Now we've the seen the four "rescuers" whose backstories are already intriguing me. Ben keeps warning them that they are up to no harm, could he be right? He knows alot about the rescuers so he obviously is up to something. And id really like alex and carl to have a bigger role. I think they are soo sweet together, and even though alex despises ben she didnt want locke to kill him.

Faith i think its all right to talk about characters that the episode will be about but dont discuss previews as we dont even get those previews. As the lost mod i just thought id tell you not to get too spoilerish :)

[love-dom-monaghan]

last night's episode was another mind-blowing :wtf: episodes?!

most shocking moment:Sayid works for Ben?!?!?!?!? :shocked:

funniest line: Hurley: i saw you do that break dancing thing with your legs, so i'm going to stay back here

[teamluke]

Some characters I do wonder, will they want to go back?

Did you like it in the last episode how Ben manipulated Sawyer, and then Sawyer manipulated Kate? I really do like that they're addressing the fact that Kate is a criminal, Sawyer's a CRIMINAL. For them to just want to go back, when they aren't currently fighting for the lives stretches, I think. Ben wants people on HIS side (or Locke's side). Kate obviously comes around though. However, just because these 6 people get off the island, doesn't mean that they WANTED to necessarily, right? What if they were on another list? The chosen people. The people who can make differences. I don't know.

It's super cool that BEN is off the island. It's even cooler that Sayid is working for him. Everyone had to know something was up. I just couldn't shake it from the very beginning. I mean, like we were supposed to believe even for a second that the same guy who couldn't torture people, because that TORTURED him, can now just knock people off? I believed he was being blackmailed from the beginning. Then we see Ben. Looks like Bens been testing on animals. Squee. Makes me so excited. If time travel/traveling machine is involved, as per what we saw with the time difference with Daniel's experiment, I wonder if Ben is sending these animals to the island?....

Faith i think its all right to talk about characters that the episode will be about but dont discuss previews as we dont even get those previews. As the lost mod i just thought id tell you not to get too spoilerish :)

Thank you for letting me know. I assumed that talking about previews was okay, because it's something we all have access to, but I do know some people like to be completely spoilerfree. I've even taken to trying to so intently focus on the show in the beginning, as to ignore the credits. But it's so hard! I just hate seeing names there that I know, and then it spoiling the surprises (like in Charlie's case).

Anyone see the closeup of that passport that Sayid (I believe it was) found? I believe the picture was of Ben (from what I could tell), but what about the name? Does he have a bunch of passports with different names? Although, this really doesn't matter, it just adds to the mystic of the whole thing. All that currency. It just makes me wonder what else he's been lying about. And I wanna know how all the people are connected that Ben's getting Sayid to kill.

[Kristen]

OMG, tonight episode was AMAZING. When Desmond was talking to Penny I was crying, it was so sweet that phone call, OMG OMGOMG/ I just loved tonight episode, it was so intense, and I love how they got back to their normal lost ways of looking back on stuff and surprising the shit out of us! :lol:

[love-dom-monaghan]

last night's episode confused me soo much..but once i understood the concept of the whole time travel thing, it was good..the phone call at the end was adorable!! :heart:

[beesknees]

I just couldn't shake it from the very beginning. I mean, like we were supposed to believe even for a second that the same guy who couldn't torture people, because that TORTURED him, can now just knock people off? I believed he was being blackmailed from the beginning. Then we see Ben. I loved the foreshadowing in the middle of the episode with Sayid saying that if he started trusting Ben, he would've sold his soul. I'm dying of curiousity to see what Sayid's motivation is in helping Ben, who mentioned something about Sayid doing this to protect his friends.

Anyone see the closeup of that passport that Sayid (I believe it was) found? I believe the picture was of Ben (from what I could tell), but what about the name? Dean Moriarity- it's a Kerouac (http://www.amazon.com/Road-50th-Anniversary-Jack-Kerouac/dp/0670063266/ref=pd_bbs_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1203269038&sr=8-4) reference. If Ben travels so much, I wonder if Sawyer will be in charge of the book club. :lol:

The Desmond episode was incredible, and I'm glad they established the time travel as more of a "consciousness time jumping" thing.

[teamluke]

It still raises a lot of questions. And I'm still trying to wrap my head around the whole thing. And more than even before, I am thinking Charles is so intertwined to the island, to Dharma, to so much. But why? I mean, I guess if you're rich, you'd want a piece of the island, if you could bottle its "powers". But is there more to it than that? Is Charles Widmore travelling too?

And what does that journal say that he bought? I'm so curious. If that was 1996, it seems that Charles has been yearning for island information for a WHILE now.

[beesknees]

It still raises a lot of questions. And I'm still trying to wrap my head around the whole thing. And more than even before, I am thinking Charles is so intertwined to the island, to Dharma, to so much. But why? I mean, I guess if you're rich, you'd want a piece of the island, if you could bottle its "powers". But is there more to it than that? Is Charles Widmore travelling too? He already has loads of money so I'd assume it was something else. I wonder if it maybe has to do with a Fountain of Youth type of motivation? There's been a lot of speculation that Richard doesn't seem to age so maybe?

And what does that journal say that he bought? I'm so curious. If that was 1996, it seems that Charles has been yearning for island information for a WHILE now.Approximate location of the island? He might have sent the Freighter people to find the Black Rock. The 2nd Lost Experience game (that they held this winter) involved a freighter that was sent to the Indian Ocean to find the Black Rock but instead "discovered" the fake Flight 815 wreckage- seems like a decoy expedition.

[Theresa]

I loved this week's episode. Im all for time travel...butterfly effect, back to the future the themes and ideas pwn me i love them and i am so glad lost is experiementing with that. I just found it funny that daniel told him to meet him in the future telling him the co-ordinates. I love daniel. It seems like he is a good guy really, whereas charlotte is so moody ugh.

[teamluke]

All that I've noticed with rich people (at least on movies, and television) they just wanna be richer. They never have enough money, and their main motivation is greed, not any real NEEDS. He's a rich guy, and so, he wants not just money, but POWER, and more and more.

If Charles doesn't know that the Black Rock is on the island, then why would he bother searching for the Black Rock? Is there something special about it in itself? If he knows that he finds the ship, he'll find the island, how would he know this? Does what Penny said before, kinda explain it? That rich people can find anyone anywhere kinda thing. So has Charles been combing the oceans? ..Anyway, the interesting thing is still that it's back in 1996.

[Danizinha]

Episode 4x07 comment:

I wrote it in gray just in case someone hasn't watched it yet, but just highlight the text to read it.


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! I can't believe it, I can't :( I can't believe Jin is dead. And they fooled us. All the time I was thinking Jin was buying the Panda for his baby and that he was going to the hospital to be with Sun, but then it was a flashback. Arrgggghhhh!
Tehn I started thinking they had gotten a divorce or something. Because Sun got back to her house and Hurley said "we should go see him". I thought "He's either in some kind of institution because he's sick or they got into a fight and divorced".
But then they started showing this green landscape and it hit me :crying:
I still can't believe it. Though now that we know it I guess there were some signs there. The whole "I'll do anything to protect you and the baby" speech. That kind of speech never ends in a good way. And then the song that played when Sun was holding Ji Yeon. I thought the song was playing because the baby had been born, since the song is called Life and Death, but then I got scared.
I just had to rant. Jin was one of my favorites, and I hate that he is gone now :(
It was really beautiful though. Especially when Sun said that he was right, they had a baby girl and she gave the baby the name he wanted :ah:

[teamluke]

I've always wanted Sun/Jin to end up happily ever after, I thought they deserved it. After watching their flashbacks you see why these people ended up on the paths they did, but the island helped them change it all around, and they love each other--- only to leave the island, and have Jin die? I'm mostly interested though because someone said that the date on the tombstone was the date of the crash. All I know is, perhaps Jin had to survive a LITTLE to be a father to the baby, to make that all believable.

What I'm talking about is the lie that Jack told. I'm gonna have to rewatch that episode, but, I'm assuming this lie has been told before. He's saying it under oath, so I wouldn't make 100 lies, or anything, right? So Kate saved 5 people, and herself. But two died. I'm gonna go and assume that one of the people that she tried to save but died anyway is Jin. When Jin dies on the timeline though, is pretty open.

For flashses we've got; Hurley, Jack, Kate, Sun. I think it's safe to assume that Jack's is last, also, Hurley's had him freaking out, but Jack is still fine. Can I assume that Kate/Sun ... then Hurley... then Jack. And I wanna know the .... in between Hurley and Jack! Do we have clues as to win Kate/Sun's flashes are? There's the age of Aaron. But how old is he now? A few months? How old is he in the flash? How long did the trials take? Mayb Sun's is first, based on that birth, and the age of Aaron. Does that make sense?

God I love this show. :)

[Danizinha]

I think the order is Sun's, then Kate's or Hurley's and the last is Jack's. Sun's flashforward has to be first because she was probably about 3 months pregnant when she left the island. When Juliet took her to the medical station and did the ultrasound she said Sun was 80 days pregnant I think. So I guess when she leaves the island she'll be a little over 3 months. So only 6 months until her flashforward.
Then Kate's flashforward, because the little boy seems to be around three years old, maybe? I'm not very good in telling children's age. But he's not that young. So Kate's flashforward is not that soon.
I have no idea when Hurley's flashback is, but we do know it's before Jack's, because Jack talks to him and doesn't want to go back, and then in Jack's FF he tells Kate they have to go back to the island.

I also heard about the gravestone date. It said September 22nd, 2004. I don't understand how can that be. Why would Sun let them put that date in the gravestone if she is still alive and knows he didn't die that day? There probably is more to Jin's death.

Jin & Sun really deserved happiness :(

[beesknees]

Though now that we know it I guess there were some signs there. The whole "I'll do anything to protect you and the baby" speech. That kind of speech never ends in a good way.Like when Sayid said that the day he started trusting Ben, would be the day he sold his soul, and then in the same episode we find out he's Ben's assassin.

I just had to rant. Jin was one of my favorites, and I hate that he is gone now :(Ditto. :( A lot of people are speculating that they're just faking his death and he's alive and well on the island, but I don't want to get my hopes up.


What I'm talking about is the lie that Jack told. I'm gonna have to rewatch that episode, but, I'm assuming this lie has been told before. He's saying it under oath, so I wouldn't make 100 lies, or anything, right? So Kate saved 5 people, and herself. But two died. I'm gonna go and assume that one of the people that she tried to save but died anyway is Jin. When Jin dies on the timeline though, is pretty open. The date on the tombstone was definitely the date of the crash: 9/22/04. As far as Jack's lie about the 8 people, the writers stated in a podcast that Jack was just lying and we should just concentrate on the 6, but I think there has to be some significance about the 8, like maybe they mean Charlie, since he was able to communicate off-island with Penny. I guess other options are Claire because of the note she tied to that carrier pigeon (maybe it was signed), Michael, or maybe Jin.

For flashses we've got; Hurley, Jack, Kate, Sun. I think it's safe to assume that Jack's is last, also, Hurley's had him freaking out, but Jack is still fine. Can I assume that Kate/Sun ... then Hurley... then Jack. And I wanna know the .... in between Hurley and Jack! Do we have clues as to win Kate/Sun's flashes are? There's the age of Aaron. But how old is he now? A few months? How old is he in the flash? How long did the trials take? Mayb Sun's is first, based on that birth, and the age of Aaron. Does that make sense?The one that seems hardest to place is Sayid's, since he didn't interact with anyone else.
Sun's- would be about 6 months after the rescue. Hurley looked pretty sane as of then.
Hurley's- going nuts. Jack still not a mess and still getting autograph requests.
Sayid's- ? He seems to have been working for Ben for a while by then.
Kate's- Aaron was about 2, I'd say and it seems that trial took a while to set up. Jack not a total mess but was drinking in the morning.
Jack's- definitely the most recent

[Krazy]

I think it's such a clever idea to have these flashforwards because i dont know..i felt the show was running out of ideas like nothing was like WOAH anymore. I mean things were happening but you just expected it so it was nice they tried a new idea. :D

I really hope they kill off the characters people hate like Locke or Michael. They seem to kill off too many good ones and it's a shame about Jin. :(

Though i agree, the time scale off these flashforwards is very difficult to place so of course it makes it more confusing. Jack's is definitely the most recent as in Kate's court case, he seemed fine and with Hurley's.

[teamluke]

I really hope they kill off the characters people hate like Locke or Michael. They seem to kill off too many good ones and it's a shame about Jin. :(

I really hated that they killed off Charlie, and now Jin! I'm holding out hope like the rest that he's alive and well on the island. HOWEVER, I love that Charlie died for a cause, and if Jin's gonna die, he better go down a hero too!

I don't want Michael or Locke to die at all! I would be so upset about that too! Although they aren't the "good guys", I still kinda root for them. It's hard to see a man who would do ANYTHING for his child as a bad man. With Locke, I've loved seeing him grow (but he has some growing still to do). Locke did BASICALLY kill Naomi. That's the kinda stuff people remember. But people don't remember JACK and a gun that wasn't loaded aimed at Locke!

I kinda like that on Lost it isn't the good guys, and the bad guys. It's the guys with other intentions, it's the guys with different beliefs, different ways--- but they're not BAD necessarily. I mean, sure, they've done bad things, but every so often, I think, even Ben isn't SO bad. I mean, you can remember the bad stuff, but that island is making murderers of them all.

I know some people really hate Locke, but I can't. He's had a hard life, and he's NOT the pathetic guy he used to be. He's so full of faith. But not having Jacob to direct him, is making him a little nutty, so I wanna see where that goes. I'm interested in Locke/Jacob/Ben.

[b]beesknees[b] I'm gonna agree with your timeline of the flashforwards! It makes the most sense to me! I doubt we'll get more clues in the next one though, but maybe, because this is the one before the break right?

[Danizinha]

Ditto. A lot of people are speculating that they're just faking his death and he's alive and well on the island, but I don't want to get my hopes up.

Yeah I've seen some speculations, but don't want to get my hopes up either. As much as I'd love it if he were still alive, I think it's best not to expect anything good. The dissapointment is so much bigger when we start speculating things like this.

The date on the tombstone was definitely the date of the crash: 9/22/04. As far as Jack's lie about the 8 people, the writers stated in a podcast that Jack was just lying and we should just concentrate on the 6, but I think there has to be some significance about the 8, like maybe they mean Charlie, since he was able to communicate off-island with Penny. I guess other options are Claire because of the note she tied to that carrier pigeon (maybe it was signed), Michael, or maybe Jin.

Was Jack reffering to people Kate rescued when they were leaving the island? When I watched that scene I had the impression he was saying that just so the jury and the judge would know how she was a good person. I thought he made up a story of how she saved some people when they first got to the island, after the plane crash. Because Kate said to him that he's told that story so many times that she thought he actually believed it. I don't know. I probably misinterpreted and need to watch that scene again. I just didn't think Jack said she saved people when they were leaving.


I really hope they kill off the characters people hate like Locke or Michael. They seem to kill off too many good ones and it's a shame about Jin.

Yeah I hate that. First Boone, then Charlie and now Jin.

I don't want Michael or Locke to die at all! I would be so upset about that too! Although they aren't the "good guys", I still kinda root for them. It's hard to see a man who would do ANYTHING for his child as a bad man. With Locke, I've loved seeing him grow (but he has some growing still to do). Locke did BASICALLY kill Naomi. That's the kinda stuff people remember. But people don't remember JACK and a gun that wasn't loaded aimed at Locke!

I really don't know if I'd like them to die or not. Sometimes I think it's not my place to judge them. But then I find it hard not to. I mean yes, they're human beings and because of that they make mistakes. But I don't like how their mistakes always affect other people.
Michael killed Ana Lucia and Libby when he didn't have to. He could've just released Ben and tied them both up. Anything. He didn't have to kill them. But he did. So as much as he was trying to save his son or whatever, I find it very hard to forgive him for that. He was instructed to get Ben back, not to kill anyone.
And then he took Jack, Sawyer, Kate and Hurley to a place he knew was dangerous. I know that he was in a tough spot, but I just think he could have come up with some other solution, or he could have warned them at least. So I don't like how he puts his family above everyone else's lives.

Locke is a little more complicated in my opinion. He's suffered a lot through life, so I sometimes feel bad for him. And it's not so much about the things he does, but how he does them. He tends not to do the "dirty" job himself. He sends other people to do it for him and I think that's really wrong.
He sent Boone to that airplane because he couldn't get up there. He blew up the hatch and sent Kate down before him. And he got Sawyer to kill his father for him because he didn't have the courage to do it himself. I find that disgusting. Of course he didn't point a gun to their heads and make them do it, but he tempted them and made them curious. And as for Sawyer, he knew things would end that way because he had Sawyer's file. So I think his mind is quite malicious, and that's what I don't like about him.
Unlike some other characters who seem to do wrong things in a moment of deep anger or desperation (like Jack), he seems to plan a lot of things and he ends up harming people a lot.

I kinda like that on Lost it isn't the good guys, and the bad guys. It's the guys with other intentions, it's the guys with different beliefs, different ways--- but they're not BAD necessarily. I mean, sure, they've done bad things, but every so often, I think, even Ben isn't SO bad. I mean, you can remember the bad stuff, but that island is making murderers of them all.

I agree. I don't see it like the good guy x the bad guy. They're all capable of doing bad things given the right circumstances.

[beesknees]

But people don't remember JACK and a gun that wasn't loaded aimed at Locke! In the same episode that had a callback to the actions of Mr. Friendly/Tom/Zeke when The Others first "met" Jack, Sawyer, Locke, and Kate. I've seen people speculate that the show will end with our Losties in the same role as The Others and that scene of Jack threatening Miles and Daniel while Sayid and Juliet hid in the bushes with guns & almost shooting Locke in cold-blood was kind of a good indicator.

He's had a hard life, and he's NOT the pathetic guy he used to be. He's so full of faith.I think that pathetic, gullible guy comes out in full force whenever he has setbacks. Too bad we haven't seen a Locke episode this season because I bet he's freaking out internally since he doesn't have a plan.

I doubt we'll get more clues in the next one though, but maybe, because this is the one before the break right?Yeah, it's the last one until April 24th.

thought he made up a story of how she saved some people when they first got to the island, after the plane crash.Yeah, I just figured there had to be something to the story about 8 initial survivors. Why not 9 or 10, you know? I'm anxious to see how this rescue goes down.


Michael killed Ana Lucia and Libby when he didn't have to. He could've just released Ben and tied them both up. Anything. He didn't have to kill them. But he did. So as much as he was trying to save his son or whatever, I find it very hard to forgive him for that. He was instructed to get Ben back, not to kill anyone. I know, right? There were a million ways he could've handled that.

He tends not to do the "dirty" job himself. He sends other people to do it for him and I think that's really wrong.ITA. If he had no problem throwing a knife into Naomi's back, why couldn't he take out his own father who stole his kidney and crippled him, both physically and emotionally.?

[teamluke]

Michael killed Ana Lucia and Libby when he didn't have to. He could've just released Ben and tied them both up.

If he had've allowed Ben to escape, and tied up the two women, he would have had to hide them as well. Because as soon as someone returned to the hatch they would have asked Micheal where Ben was, and then IF by chance Libby/Ana Lucia did lie for him I think he was afraid of it all coming out eventually. When the "plan" was hatched, I do think that Micheal was instructed to make them oblivious, they weren't SUPPOSED to know what was going on. So, Micheal was desperate. I've rewatched the episodes fairly recently and we see his PURE DESPERATION. Just the way he screams Walt, and the guilt he has for "losing" his son. He treats it like he was being neglectful, that Walt wasn't TAKEN, that he, as a father just FAILED. So Micheal takes steps that a father takes when he's DESPERATE. When he relies on the Others to make good on their word. Because, you might think, why WOULD he trust them?... Because THAT'S all you have, really. Someone kidnaps your kid, and they want 20430832048230824 dollars, you get them that money. Whatever they want, you do it. And you don't think rationally, being rational went out when your kid got TAKEN, when you FAILED. .... I just totally get Micheal.

...And just to mention, I TOTALLY think that that guy on the freighter KNOWS that Micheal is Micheal, and he is not Kevin. That's why we're not to trust the Captain. Because, when you think of it, the CAPTAIN should have rightfully killed the "spy", right? But since he didn't, doesn't that mean that there's MORE going on? I keep thinking that this boat isn't just about Charles Widmore, it may be FUNDED by Charles Widmore, but there's probably another guy in charge. .... Say Abbandon? Or whatever his name was.

When I think about Micheal, he's not a hero. He's weak, and he's conflicted, and he tries to be the good guy, but he's not "the hero". Antihero? ... If it were Jack he would have spent so much time thinking of how he could save EVERYBODY that more would have died. Jack's really weak too. But it's like he has this connection to EVERYBODY, he has to save EVERYBODY. He has that complex. I'm the hero, and it's my JOB. I'm the DOCTOR. That doesn't mean I think it was right for him to kill those people, but I get it. When Ana Lucia couldn't kill Ben, his plan unfolded. There was never gonna be a time when they'd let Ben just GO, there was never gonna be a time when Ben was alone at the Hatch. Micheal couldn't wait either.

I think that pathetic, gullible guy comes out in full force whenever he has setbacks. Too bad we haven't seen a Locke episode this season because I bet he's freaking out internally since he doesn't have a plan.

You're right, I bet he IS freaking out. I like seeing the hunter Locke, the badass Locke. The one that has his shit together. And I'm not saying that he should always, but when he DOESNT he freaks out like a baby! He has a little tantrum, and cries! Locke can't die until he gets over the fact that sometimes you DO lose your faith, and it's frustrating, but there's no need to freak out. Sometimes you just have to have patience. So, Locke feels like he's been thrown a bone by "fate", or by Jacob, but he hasn't. He's so a pawn in Ben's game. It's not his last bargaining chip! Damnit! Ben will always have another chip! Has Locke not realized this? He IS still gullible! Now, the guy who's conning him isn't RELATED to him but it's still the same. And since Ben knows ALL about Locke's life it's so easy for him to play on those insecurities.

In the last episode, .. it was good, but I can't help but think... where is the TRUTH?
Who's really in control of that ship? And how long exactly has communication been out? Why hasn't Micheal fufilled his promise? What does the Captain now? And if it IS Charles ship (as they say), why the heck is he just twiddling his thumbs? Isn't he freaking out that there hasn't been word? Why doesn't he send another boat? I wanna see a flash that includes some Charles!!

It was a good point about it not being good vs bad. And I definitely like the idea that our Losties are the new Others (in a way). I believe the same people who are killed Karl/Danielle(? we don't know for sure if she's dead), perhaps already got to the Temple. Killed all of them. And Ben almost knowing this, must use the Losties as his defence. After all, he needs someone on his team. So he let Locke in, and will use those people to protect him.

I hate when an episode is based on one group or the other. There's one part of me that's thinking well what are Jack/Kate doing? What about Juliet? What about Faraday and Charlotte!!!

[beesknees]

If he had've allowed Ben to escape, and tied up the two women, he would have had to hide them as well. The way I fanwank it, he could've gone into the armory to execute Ben, let Ben "overpower" him and take the gun. Feasibly, Ben could've escaped without anyone getting hurt (though he probably would've shot Ana Lucia for the hell of it). But you make a good point about rational behavior being implausible in Michael's case, especially once he met with Walt in the Others' camp and saw that the kid was completely terrified.

So, Locke feels like he's been thrown a bone by "fate", or by Jacob, but he hasn't. He's so a pawn in Ben's game. It's not his last bargaining chip! Damnit! Ben will always have another chip! Has Locke not realized this? He IS still gullible! Now, the guy who's conning him isn't RELATED to him but it's still the same. And since Ben knows ALL about Locke's life it's so easy for him to play on those insecurities. It's so frustrating, isn't it? Like a couple of episodes ago, when Locke took Ben food and Ben tried to prey on his insecurities again and Locke seemed to see through his tricks and you'd think that finally (Finally!) he was getting a clue, but then he threw a tantrum and tossed Ben's food tray against the wall. Sigh...

In the last episode, .. it was good, but I can't help but think... where is the TRUTH?Maybe we'll know by the end of the season? Hopefully.

I believe the same people who are killed Karl/Danielle(? we don't know for sure if she's dead), perhaps already got to the Temple. Killed all of them.I hope not, though it'd be kind of fitting that the people who purged Dharma got purged themselves. I'll be mad if they kill Richard Alpert off-screen. The print issue of this week's TV Guide said he'd be coming back for at least one ep. this season, though it could be in flashback.

[teamluke]

I want a full out episode on Richard Alpert, and I'm guessing you, beesknees would share the same delight in that! I find him all mysterious, I think he has so many of the answers. I think Lost is good with irony... And if the people who headed the purge died in a "purge" kinda thing, it would be kinda funny.

You're right about going into where Ben was being held captive, but maybe Micheal thought ahead far enough to realize that the Others couldn't be trusted, and he shouldn't be just giving out guns? That the safest person to have the gun is himself. However, if Ben was the one to have shot Libby, Ana Lucia AND Micheal why did he leave the gun behind? Or did Ben end up taking it anyway? I completely forget!

I was watching S2 recently, so I really appreciated the scene with Locke throwing the tantrum after talking to Ben. He did the same exact thing before when BENRY was being held captive in the Hatch. Threw everything down, because he was frustrated with his faith, and where it was or rather where it wasn't leading him. I think it cut to Benry smiling because he had heard Locke's frustration. I love the call-backs to episodes like that!

On another board I was reminded by the gun you see in the first act, will be used in the third--- Although I haven't heard of this exact expression before, I did see how it could be applied here. Those guys, someone off the freighter, possibly not the same ones that were shooting, found their way to the Temple. There's only a COUPLE of things wrong with that. None of our Losties have found this temple.... how could unknowns do it so easily? Also, the guns seem different. ....But didn't it seem like they were practising for moving targets, and stuff? Like I think Michael was thinking, "is this really what we should be doing, aren't we gonna SAVE people", but they wanted to practise using their guns... So maybe it'll be another "purge".

I still wanna see more of the Others. I know some people wanna stick to original cast members, but I'm more about finding out about the island, and the hostiles, Dharma .... To me, I'm trying to find out how/why the original cast members, our losties,.... how they fit into the puzzle, not the other way around. I guess some people see the show differently, because they're thinking about character progression, but I'm really not. I mean, I WANT to see characters grow, and change, but I want it to be more about this island.... :)

[beesknees]

I want a full out episode on Richard Alpert, and I'm guessing you, beesknees would share the same delight in that! I find him all mysterious, I think he has so many of the answers. Oh, definitely. Richard is a character with lots of potential. I'd love to see more on-island flashbacks. I wonder if next season we'll see more of those while the O6 concurrently find out more about the island in the flashforwards. That could be a neat way to tie things together.

Or did Ben end up taking it anyway? I completely forget!I think he took it after Michael shot himself.

None of our Losties have found this temple.... how could unknowns do it so easily?Daniel and Charlotte had a rudimentary map, but it might be possible that the mercenaries had better instructions, maybe from Ben's guy that Charles Widmore was beating the crap out of?

Just for fun, here's a podcast regarding the latest episode and many other unanswered questions: http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2008/03/abc-official-podcast.html

[teamluke]

I'm thinking that's the way it'll go, [b]beesknees[b]. Like they'll tease this season with all the flashforwards, and then next season they'll do a lot of on island flashbacks, and then tie it all together in the final season. Which is the only time when we'll finally get the WHOLE picture. Which is very cool.

If Ben infact did take the gun then my explanation for why Micheal did the things he did the way he did doesn't entirely make the MOST sense. But I still get it, I still get Micheal. I don't know if I trust Micheal, ya know? ... But from what I can tell all of his intentions are in direct relation to Walt, so it makes sense.

Thanks for giving that link! That podcast was informative. And I forget the interesting stuff that I learned now! There were no big reveals, nor was it spoilery, unless you call them confirming that something WAS the way we interpreted it spoilery...

There's a lot of island mysteries. I wanna know how Christian Sheppard fits into everything. But I bet that's like season six kinda stuff.

...Now, onto an important question... who thinks that Danielle-- a woman who survived for 16 years on her own-- is DEAD? I know she kept safe because of avoiding situations/confrontations like this, but STILL. I really don't think she's dead. However, I also don't think she's faking. She's smart... so I just think if she faked it, stayed down, she would have known Alex would offer herself, saying she's Ben's daughter...

[Danizinha]

I guess I can understand why Michael did some of the things he did. But I find it hard to "forgive" him. I mean yes, he did most of it for Walt. But I don't know. He had time to do a little thinking while he walked from wherever he was to the hatch. He must have imagined that Ben would never be alone. Of course there would be at least one person guarding him. And he's lucky it was some people he hadn't met before. What if it had been one of his "friends"? Would he have done it anyway?

The others told him to release Ben. The losties would have found out Michael released Ben sooner or later. And he knew they'd find out. So it wouldn't really have made a difference if Ana Lucia and Libby were still alive and told the losties. The only difference is that they'd find out a little earlier.

I also want to know how Christian Sheppard relates to the whole story. He seems to have a connection with a big part of the group. There must be something really important connected to his character.

I also had the impression that Danielle could not be dead. They didn't show exactly where the bullet hit her...Maybe the wound won't be fatal. We'll have to wait and see.

[toastedbagel]

First, I'll share something fun I wrote up: What if the Cast of “Lost” was Re-Arranged? (http://www.sofachip.com/2008/04/07/what-if-the-cast-of-lost-was-re-arranged/)

I've been reviewing most of the season four episodes we've had. My favorite was 'The Constant'.

This URL will bring you to all of my reviews or lost-tagged posts: http://www.sofachip.com/tag/lost/

[Danizinha]

:shocked: Just watched last episode and I'm still shocked at how good it was.

Sawyer was so great. He just stepped up and tried to protect the people around him. He risked his life to save Claire, then decided to go back to the beach and tried to protect Hurley as well. Loved him in this episode even more.

Is it just me or does anybody else think Jack has appendicitis or something like that? He was taking antibiotics and he flinched in pain when he was threatening Daniel, so that came to my mind.

Thank goodness Claire didn't die. I was so scared and then relieved when she came out of the house alive.

Killing Alex was just so cruel. These people have no moral rules or heart for that matter. They will definitely take things to the last of consequences to get what they want.

So Ben can control the smoke monster? I was :eek: when I saw that. Apparently he has some kind of power over it.

And that man has got some strange powers too. He convinced Sayid to help him, pretending he didn't want any help, but then smiled when Sayid said it was his war too, as if that's what he had been planning all along. Very weird.

And OMG I can't believe Ben is going after Penny. I just froze when he said "I'm going to kill your daughter". As much as I want Ben to have his revenge, because I understand he was the victim in this, he can't kill Penny. Not Penny! I can only imagine now how things will develop. The whole Desmond/Ben/Penny plot is about to get very heavy.

Great episode! :bgrin:

[chewie]

And OMG I can't believe Ben is going after Penny. I just froze when he said "I'm going to kill your daughter". As much as I want Ben to have his revenge, because I understand he was the victim in this, he can't kill Penny. Not Penny! I can only imagine now how things will develop. The whole Desmond/Ben/Penny plot is about to get very heavy.



Just my opinion but I think they'll wait for next season to further this story.

[teamluke]

But Penny is Desmond's CONSTANT!

And the plot thickens. (If that sounded sarcastic, it wasn't supposed to be, lol.)

I'm really loving this. This episode was amaZING. However, I'm suddenly, really randomly filled with a lot of questions about Danielle. Is there a Danielle thread? I didn't see one. That's the next mystery I kinda want them to talk about.

Then leave the time traveling/teleporting stuff with Ben for a little while, lol. I wonder what's gonna happen in the finale. How are they gonna top changing the tone of the show (from flashbacks to flashforwards)? What's it gonna be now? Is it just gonna be their rescue? And if it is their rescue (in the finale) what are they gonna do for the finale 2 years? I wonder how the audience is gonna invest if people aren't in as many episodes. I wonder how S3 (the beginning) did ratingswise. I know you can't please everyone though.

Does anyone know if there's a podcast on each episode?

[beesknees]

Is it just me or does anybody else think Jack has appendicitis or something like that? That's my guess as well. And Juliet will probably have to fix it.

Killing Alex was just so cruel.That was awful. :( This show has gotten soooo dark.

I'm not uber-excited about this turning into the Ben Linus show. He's a great character and Michael Emerson is a genius, but I like seeing him more in a 'supporting actor' capacity.

I wonder what's gonna happen in the finale. How are they gonna top changing the tone of the show (from flashbacks to flashforwards)? I think I read something in EW or TVGuide about having the current arc and the flashforwards meld into present time this season but who knows about the next one?

Does anyone know if there's a podcast on each episode? Yep. :) http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/search/label/Podcasts

[teamluke]

Thanks for that beesknees!

I've read a lot of different views, and you know, you aren't alone by thinking/worrying about this becoming the Ben Show. But the way I see it is they're just telling more of the story, like this part was inevitable. Because to me LOST is more about the island than strickly the losties, and how they survive. I mean it's about that TOO, but I wanna know all the mysteries, and I like experience everything just as they do. They find another video, and we learn. However, to get this stuff from Ben's flashbacks feels even cooler, because it's not something the losties actually know. We know more than them, but we're still trying to figure out whether he's the good guy, or the bad guy...

[Danizinha]

Yeah you're right. I don't think Ben will exactly be a lead now. I think he'll be really important and will play a bigger part for some time. But it's only natural. He went to the island when he was very young and has lived there ever since. He probably knows more about the island than anyone else. So for us to start finding out some of the answers, he has to play a bigger role. It seems like there's some sort of battle between him and Charles Widmore. That will be interesting to see. Like...why do both of them want the island so much? What does the island have that is so special for people to fight over it?
And of course, the usual questions concerning what happens in the island and why. I think Ben is one of the only ones who can answer that.

[beesknees]

Oh, I do love learning about Ben and his connection to the island. I'm just not too jazzed about the idea of the characters that we know becoming pawns in a Ben-Widmore vendetta...that's not a direction I'd like to see show go because it seems so disconnected from the initial premise of the show.

Hey, this is my 108th post!

4-8-15-16-23-42

Reset!

:lol:

[teamluke]

Lol, 108th post, congrats! lol.

I don't like the idea of it just being about Widmore/Ben, as much as I love Ben... It would be upsetting to know that they were merely just pawns, and didn't matter. However, from the show, I've always grasped that it was very handpicked that these losties were on that plane, THAT plane.... And so, I think they all have individual purposes.

Also, does anyone know of how Sun's dad could possibly fit into this? I think there has to be a connection too.

[teamluke]

I'm sorry for the double post, but I wish we had an episode thread, and I don't understand why this isn't more jumping!! Lost only has what... like 3 episodes left, and where is the hype? I've been visiting other boards, and they're so alive....

Anyway, this past episode really made me think. And I've read some new theories, and really have been intrigued. The part that has intrigued me is connections (which is SO abundant on Lost). I've always loved the religious part, the part that has to do with the Bible. And I don't know if people are interested, OR if it's been brought up before, but I find it interesting, so I'll share:

Jacob in the Bible had a son named Benjamin.

And that has always interested me, because I thought, it'd be cool if there was a brother named John, it would have been perfect. Especially since Jacob had so many different "wives" in his life, the idea that Ben/Locke could have been half brothers was SUPER cool. Or also I like the comparison of Esau/Jacob, and I always see John as Esau, and for those who don't know Esau and Jacob were twins. And Jacob stole Esau's birthrights, but I can explain this later if someone asks.

Anyway, I read this theory about re-incarnation. And I thought this was cool. Because Lost deals with so many different religions, and references. So what if... We met Jacob when we did because he was reincarnated through Aaron? We forget the episode we MET Jacob... It was in the one where Locke/Ben go to see him. When did we first see the "God loves you as he LOVED Jacob"....? In that video when Karl was being brainwashed? ...Anyway, we met Jacob when we did because now he's still alive. Tie the time traveling to reincarnation and it kinda explains the phasing out Jacob.

What's cool about this to tie into the Bible (and names with references) is that Aaron is the great great grandson of Jacob. Also, this shows how Christian was important. Although Christian said he wasn't Jacob, he wasn't, he could definitely be the reincarnated soul of him, though, right? I just think it's so interesting. I wonder too if that's why Christian spent a lot of his life telling his son (his only son) that he wasn't good enough, blah, blah, blah, he didn't have what it takes. And he wasn't talking specifically about being a doctor, but a LEADER, he wasn't "THE ONE". So, when Claire's mom is in that wreck, Christian pays for it, feeling dutiful to the daughter... right? But what it was really about was meeting Claire, and seeing if there was potential there for a son... "the new Jacob".

Is this getting confusing? Because when my boyfriend and I thought of this idea, more things came up that made it all make sense to us. I'd really appreciate some questions, or something on the subject! Thanks! :)

[merder.]

Hello :)
I always wonder why these threads aren't more alive, with the season being so close to over and still so many questions unanswered.
The theories I've read (which are a limited few at that) have mostly been more simple, about Ben being able to project himself and some things about Richard not changing ages and such. But I think what you said is really interesting. It is confusing, but there are so many connections on Lost that I really think anything is possible. I am not a religious person at all so the Bible reference was something I was rather ignorant to, but I really think that is a good theory (:
Also, is Christian alive? And my friends and I have had a theory that Claire has been dead for a little while, too...I could go on and on but yeah :P

[teamluke]

Hello :)
I always wonder why these threads aren't more alive, with the season being so close to over and still so many questions unanswered.
The theories I've read (which are a limited few at that) have mostly been more simple, about Ben being able to project himself and some things about Richard not changing ages and such. But I think what you said is really interesting. It is confusing, but there are so many connections on Lost that I really think anything is possible. I am not a religious person at all so the Bible reference was something I was rather ignorant to, but I really think that is a good theory (:
Also, is Christian alive? And my friends and I have had a theory that Claire has been dead for a little while, too...I could go on and on but yeah :P

I always frequent more than one forum, so I get my fix, but fanbolt is my favorite, so I wish the Lost forums were more... you know... hyped!

People think that Richard looks ageless because of time traveling. But, that doesn't make sense, really. Considering the kinda time traveling we've seen on Lost has been more of a misplaced MIND, not body. Which means that Richard should be able to go back in time, and forward in time (I guess) but only in times that he's existed in, and only in the body that he existed in at that time. So, someone has yet to explain that to me. Maybe Richard is just way more intune, and has perfected the time travel, much like it seems Ben has, because to me, it seems he knows where he's going, and is prepared. Desmond couldn't carry a written phone number with him to the present (when he asked Penny), but Ben had a passport. However, maybe that's the alias he used at that time. But that doesn't really explain the parka, and how he had that.... Anyway, it seems that maybe Desmond may get better at controlling it? Desmond can time travel from being exposed to electromagnatic stuff, whereas Ben uses THAT to time travel (I'm assuming), and same with Richard.

You should go on if you have theories, I'll try to frequent this board and keep it more alive!

I think Claire at LEAST died when her house exploded like ON HER. I think the fact of the exchange between Claire/Miles points to that. Claire says something like, "I'll live." And Miles says something along the lines of, "I wouldn't count on it... " or ... "We'll see..." Or SOMETHING. Really suggesting that she's dead. And the fact that she's hanging out with a dead guy really signifies something. BUT I think it's tres more interesting that Locke can see a man who isn't alive who he hasn't met. How many instances have we had of this? Locke has also seen Yemi, and yet he has not met him. Hurley saw Christian and they haven't met. Other examples?

Anyway, Claire's hanging out with a dead guy, and she's all high looking. She's GOTTA be dead. Now, why she hasn't "passed on", because remember when Sawyer took the rubble off of her she says, "Charlie?" as if seeing Charlie at the pearly gates (heaven)... So maybe Claire is caught in between. She's in the limbo. Everyone talked about purgatory, and I don't think all the losties are there, but Claire is, OR, since she's in the line of Jacob (by Christian) she is set to be reincarnated? Perhaps Sun's baby will be special too!!! Because I'm still waiting for Sun/Jin to be connected with everything, and Sun's dad.

Whew. But that's again getting too complicated.

[merder.]

Yeah, I always wonder if the writers intend on it being so confusing, or if they have much simpler ways for things to go and if I'm overanalyzing everything. The whole Claire thing is quite odd, as with seeing dead people who they've never encountered. I don't have the time for an indepth analysis right now...but if you could suggest a few theories to read that would be nice!

[teamluke]

Well, I don't think Lost is gonna wrap up in a tight neat bow at the end, and the creators have basically said so much. Like somethings are just.... as is. Some people will call them fate, and destiny, but some things are just concidences. And they said that if they explained every last thing, it would take away the mystery of the show (and, I might add leave the show with NO rewatching value).

I think LOST is supposed to be for hardcore fans. It's supposed to be for people who are a bit nerdy, and willing to give it the time. It's not something you watch one or two episodes of, I think you're either a FAN of LOST, or you're not. There's no grey area, it's all black and white.

So, if I were to articulate my theories better, I think we could manage to salvage some of them. I don't think they're too confusing, but they're confusing when I lay them all out, because I get so distracted. One thing reminds me of something else, and then that reminds me of something else--- and then I'm totally sidetracked. I should just write out a few theories, and try to keep them ON FOCUS. It'd be a real project for me. lol.

I'm not sure if we're allowed (on Fanbolt) to link to other forums. But all I've done is read odd theories here and there, and developed my own ideas. But this idea of reincarnation is just something I'm so interested in, and if anyone reading this has ever read about it, or researched it, I'd like to know anything they've read. Also, the concept of being dead. I wonder if there's ever been any cases of people who have dwindled in that space between being alive, and seeing the light. There's a lot of medical miracles. I don't think medical miracles are in a state of being conscious enough to walk, and talk like Claire though. But I wanna know more about THAT. I wanna talk about dead, because the island has always been about dead or not.

Like for instance there's the "ghosts" people see, dead people that they've known in their life. That the island doesn't know, hasn't met, because those people have never been on the island. Then there's Niki/Paulo, who people HATED, but they brought up such an interesting point, THEY WERE BURIED ALIVE. I wonder ... because of the time messups... the delays, and what not--- Is it at all possible that that makes that point of time, the time between being alive, and being dead a little more stretched? Like normally, you get shot like John did, and you bleed out. But what makes you dead? What contributes to being dead? Is it part of shock? And if you take that shock away, are you calm like Claire was? And if you're calm, or rather full of that feeling where you can't feel pain.... those endorphins that are released .... do you survive? Could you survive? Or rather, could your death to be prolonged? And that would be because of the time mess .....

I think I just blew my own mind. lol.

[merder.]

:lol: I agree, the mystery isn't one made to be completely solved. And I don't know what else to say to your whole dead thing except that you're right. The only thing I'm sure of is that the island is a weird place...with the time changes, the healing, and all of that.

[teamluke]

Well my idea about the "dead" thing, really helps explain the healing stuff. I wish there was some really scholar who knew stuff about being dead, and what happens to someone medically. I mean, I'll try to research it, and see what I come up with if I have some time today. I guess all this stuff will keep us entertained until the next season as well.

I am just so excited about Thursday. SO SO excited, and I can't waiiiitttt. I'm loving Lost perhaps more than ever before this season, and right at this very moment too.

[teamluke]

Less than two days until the finale! I've never BEEN so excited! :)

And I've remained spoiler-free! I don't know how I've done it, this two weeks in between has made it that much more trying.

[love-dom-monaghan]

YAY!!! :dancing::dancing::dancing: finale night!! i'm so excited

[teamluke]

NO ONE has posted? Seriously? :(

[Danizinha]

So many questions haha.

The main one that goes through my head is how the heck can someone move an island? :lol:
And what connection does it have with the Casimir effect that they've mentioned? I looked it up and understood basically nothing :lol: Something about a force appearing between two uncharged metallic plates. After that it got really complicated and I gave up reading about it haha.

Anyway...it's also weird for me that Locke became the "leader", but in the future time he's inside the coffin, and everyone is referring to him as Jeremy Bentham.

I'm really curious to know what are the horrible things that happened to the people who stayed in the island and why Jack is being blamed for them. I guess Locke's "death" has something to do with that.

The Miles/Charlotte conversation made me really confused. She was trying to go back to the island? Very weird.

For me, the highlight of the episode was Desmond and Penny's reunion. They've waited for so long. It was so sad to see them finally together, in a beautiful way obviously. I was half expecting for something tragic to happen when I saw her, but thankfully they made it.

[teamluke]

So many questions haha.

Do you think this is the reason for the dead forum? I hope so. I hope it isn't because of lack of interest. That would make me sad. The more I watch of Lost the more excited I am. I really want to watch the finale again. I wish they'd move up the DVD release!

The main one that goes through my head is how the heck can someone move an island? :lol:

The significant part (I think) is the Orientation Video that Locke was watching. He said, "And the bunny seems to disappear", and the key word is it SEEMS to be. I still have have to think about that line some more. Because the big clue next is that the tape is REWINDING. Is that a HINT to the audience, to Locke, that the island is exactly where we left it, but in the past?

Anyway...it's also weird for me that Locke became the "leader", but in the future time he's inside the coffin, and everyone is referring to him as Jeremy Bentham.

Locke's one of the CHOSEN. So was Ben. We're unsure of how many "chosen" people they are. Maybe Walt is one of them, maybe Aaron will be, maybe Christian was, it's all pretty uncertain. But the fact remains that someone needs to be the "leader", and the leader will ultimately end his reign by sacrificing himself (by parting with the island). Ben turned the wheel to move the island, and ended up somewhere else. Locke will do this too. He'll move the island, after giving the reigns to someone else... and who will this be...??? Both Walt/Aaron are too young. So, as Locke is running around, he is going by a totally different name, just like Micheal did. Because the only people who get to "keep" their names are the ones that are apart of the Oceanic Six. Essentially, it's not just the Oceanic 6 that have to lie.

I'm really curious to know what are the horrible things that happened to the people who stayed in the island and why Jack is being blamed for them. I guess Locke's "death" has something to do with that.

I guess Jack is feeling guilt for what happened in the helicopter, he kept urging Frank to leave, leave. That's why Jin got left behind. However, some could argue that if Frank had've went back everything would've blown up. I feel bad for Jack. He's totally losing it. The way the Losties question Locke, is the way I feel people harass Jack for leading. I think Ben/Locke had a conversation about people undermining the leader. People give Jack a lot of crap, and it's unfair. He said himself he never asked for this position, and yet people always looked to him for answers. So he gave them. So he CHOSE for them. And now he's suffering for all the wrong choices that were placed on him. I just feel like there rarely is a right solution for EVERYBODY. So if Jack wasn't the "bad leader" someone else would be.

The Miles/Charlotte conversation made me really confused. She was trying to go back to the island? Very weird.

THIS IS SO COOL. Charlotte has BEEN to the island before? How did she get here before? What did she THINK before? What is so important to come back? Is she the ONLY real island baby?! (Both concieved and birthed on island.) Also, she told Daniel she was looking for where she was born.... !!!!!!


For me, the highlight of the episode was Desmond and Penny's reunion. They've waited for so long. It was so sad to see them finally together, in a beautiful way obviously. I was half expecting for something tragic to happen when I saw her, but thankfully they made it.

They have their happy ending, but Ben's still gonna try to kill Penny in the future, so.... :(

[Danizinha]

Do you think this is the reason for the dead forum? I hope so. I hope it isn't because of lack of interest. That would make me sad. The more I watch of Lost the more excited I am. I really want to watch the finale again. I wish they'd move up the DVD release!

I think it must be the reason. I guess it gets so confusing at times that people don't know where to start from :lol: New mysteries are great, but I hope that in next season we start getting some important answers.


The significant part (I think) is the Orientation Video that Locke was watching. He said, "And the bunny seems to disappear", and the key word is it SEEMS to be. I still have have to think about that line some more. Because the big clue next is that the tape is REWINDING. Is that a HINT to the audience, to Locke, that the island is exactly where we left it, but in the past?

Wow, good point. So apparently they don't move the island physically speaking. It has something to do with time travel? We already know that the island and the rest of the world are separated by a certain period of time. Or, at least, things happen in different time gaps. I wonder why they were instructed not to use anything metallic.


Locke's one of the CHOSEN. So was Ben. We're unsure of how many "chosen" people they are. Maybe Walt is one of them, maybe Aaron will be, maybe Christian was, it's all pretty uncertain. But the fact remains that someone needs to be the "leader", and the leader will ultimately end his reign by sacrificing himself (by parting with the island). Ben turned the wheel to move the island, and ended up somewhere else. Locke will do this too. He'll move the island, after giving the reigns to someone else... and who will this be...??? Both Walt/Aaron are too young. So, as Locke is running around, he is going by a totally different name, just like Micheal did. Because the only people who get to "keep" their names are the ones that are apart of the Oceanic Six. Essentially, it's not just the Oceanic 6 that have to lie.

That's true. But it's been about 3 years since they left the island. I guess some pretty bad things happened in 3 years for Locke to lose his "reign" so quickly, when Ben was the leader for such a long time. Maybe it has to do with the fact that Charles Widmore is getting closer to reaching his goal.


I guess Jack is feeling guilt for what happened in the helicopter, he kept urging Frank to leave, leave. That's why Jin got left behind. However, some could argue that if Frank had've went back everything would've blown up. I feel bad for Jack. He's totally losing it. The way the Losties question Locke, is the way I feel people harass Jack for leading. I think Ben/Locke had a conversation about people undermining the leader. People give Jack a lot of crap, and it's unfair. He said himself he never asked for this position, and yet people always looked to him for answers. So he gave them. So he CHOSE for them. And now he's suffering for all the wrong choices that were placed on him. I just feel like there rarely is a right solution for EVERYBODY. So if Jack wasn't the "bad leader" someone else would be.

Yeah I agree. When everyone expects you to make decisions for them, something like this ends up happening. I don't remember the scene very well now, but I remember someone saying Jack received a visit and that he got blamed for the terrible things that happened in the island after they left. I don't think the person meant only the explosion. I think that the people who stayed in the island are suffering, maybe Widmore sent more expeditions to find the island, and the ones he sent are killing the losties. I haven't a clue. And I really want to know what is the purpose of the Oceanic 6 and Locke going back.


THIS IS SO COOL. Charlotte has BEEN to the island before? How did she get here before? What did she THINK before? What is so important to come back? Is she the ONLY real island baby?! (Both conceived and birthed on island.) Also, she told Daniel she was looking for where she was born.... !!!!!!

Yes, exactly. She was looking for the place she was born. So maybe she left the island and spent all that time trying to go back. But why?
Also...she speaks korean, which led my sister to point out that maybe she has some connection to Sun's father, or his company.


They have their happy ending, but Ben's still gonna try to kill Penny in the future, so.... :(

Yeah I'm worried. I hope he doesn't do it. I mean...he wants his revenge. And he knows that killing Widmore's daughter will make him duffer more than if he kills Widmore himself. But I hope he doesn't go down that road. Penny has nothing to do with it, as Alex didn't. Neither one of them should have to pay for their father's little war.

[teamluke]

Wow, good point. So apparently they don't move the island physically speaking. It has something to do with time travel? We already know that the island and the rest of the world are separated by a certain period of time. Or, at least, things happen in different time gaps. I wonder why they were instructed not to use anything metallic.

What I had suggested, that the island is just in the past (because of the video) people have said is anticlimatic. Since Desmond's time travel trip, I've always wanted to use time travel to explain things. As I used the island shift as trying to explain the Black Rock's location, could it also explain the 4 toed statue? Because if the island IS moving through space, what's to say it always ends up in WATER? It'd be interesting if it ended up on something else, or very near something else. Could that be another reason why moving the island is so dangerous (you don't know where it will end up)?

I always think there's gonna be a BIG answer, but this is LOST, not a movie. There's no big answer that connects all the small questions, and ties 'em together in a small little bow. Right now we've got a time tripping Desmond AND Daniel... We've got time diference between a boat and an island... We've got time traveling bunnies, and a room that can move the island. To me, that's a lot of different stuff.

What I wanna know is why Ben's been using that Orchid station. And I do assume he's been using it. From all the passports, and money we saw, the fact that he seemed like a preferred customer at the hotel... AND the offislandy looking picture we saw. But what would the purpose be? Tom (aka Mr.Friendly) went off on non-island missions. So what were Ben's missions? AND how did he get back? If the guy in the Orientation Video said they only APPEAR to be gone, does that hault the theory that anyone could use that booth for time travel? Or is there something that they do, to take them back, and the time is so close to when they actually left it barely seems like they were gone at all?

That's true. But it's been about 3 years since they left the island. I guess some pretty bad things happened in 3 years for Locke to lose his "reign" so quickly, when Ben was the leader for such a long time. Maybe it has to do with the fact that Charles Widmore is getting closer to reaching his goal.

It's weird because when we watched Locke's episode, I felt like he was MORE chosen than Ben. It was just that feeling. If he only is leader for roughly 3 years, how can he be so important? So what did Locke do? What went down? Is it safe to assume that the only reason to move the island is because someone ELSE found it? I think so. The short lapse in time for people finding it again means it doesn't look good for the island!


Also...she speaks korean, which led my sister to point out that maybe she has some connection to Sun's father, or his company.

I totally forgot this. However, there is the scene in Charlotte's "flashback" where the girl she's with says somethign like, "How many langauges do you have to read that in to believe it's true?" So her speaking Korean could mean nothing. But now I'm all interested in Charlotte and her connection to Sun is interesting!

Out of all the deaths (and not just this season, the SHOW) I am ticked about Danielle. And who's flashbacks is she gonna show up in, anyway? So we can finally know her story.

Does anyone think we'll get some "regular" others, because of Locke's leadership in the next season? Or will it be mostly Locke/Richard, and a bunch of red shirts?

[Caroline™]

I think it must be the reason. I guess it gets so confusing at times that people don't know where to start from :lol: New mysteries are great, but I hope that in next season we start getting some important answers.




Wow, good point. So apparently they don't move the island physically speaking. It has something to do with time travel? We already know that the island and the rest of the world are separated by a certain period of time. Or, at least, things happen in different time gaps. I wonder why they were instructed not to use anything metallic.


I think the island must physically move, and if it does, it explains a few things. For example, how did the Black Rock end up ship wrecked so far inland? Well my guess is that it was sailing along quite hapily in open water, but at that same moment, some one moved the island and it just so happened to move to where the boat was sailing. So in other words, the island appeared from beneath the boat, hence why it was ship wrecked far in land.

It also helps explain how a light weight aircraft which Yemi and the drug smugglers were on made it to the island. The island most probably wasn't in the South Pacific back them (because how would a light weight aircraft have made it from Africa to the South Pacific) my guess is that at some point in time, it was just off the coast of Africa. *nods* Just my ponderings.

[teamluke]

With what I'm thinking (in my posts), I'm not saying the island NEVER has moved, but it's possible that this time it really hasn't. It has just appeared to disappear. BUT the question is: Would it be funny or REALLY annoying to see Ben/Widmore and others scramble to find an island that never TRULY left?

Sometimes the space/time stuff starts to hurt my brain because of "the rules". And with no prior knowledge, what ARE the rules, anyway? You can read a book, a douzen books, but since it isn't EXACTLY factual (well, according to some) you can make up whatever rules you want. And THIS is where I'm confused. Like if Ben pushes it back in time, shouldn't there be a point when someone puts it "back"? Or can we have our island just shift around willy nilly?

Another question is: Can they "hide" the island again? I'm confused because when the Hatch imploded didn't it break this? Didn't it make the island visible again? So when you think of it, Ben HAD to have moved the island backwards, right? Back to a time when the Hatch exsisted so that he could "hide" the island from people trying to find it.

[Chris]

oh my season 4 was just pure amazement!!! I cant wait to see what season 5 brings!

[love-dom-monaghan]

Season 5 is going to be crazy!!..i can't wait to see what they have in store for us when it comes back!! :D

[Chris]

Me too!! I cant wait to see what twists and surprises are waiting for us!! Im way too excited :lol:

[love-dom-monaghan]

i know!! :dancing:
for sure this season will be about why they have to get back to the island

[Chris]

I think its to save all their friends but who knows :lol: HOw many epsides will season 5 have?

[love-dom-monaghan]

yah that's what i think it is..a la Charlie'd "they need you!"
season 5 and 6 will each have 17 episodes to make up for episodes lost during the strike :D

[Chris]

aw cool! its not that many episodes shorter than an average season so its not too bad :)

[love-dom-monaghan]

i know, i`m excited!! the more lost the better! :D:dancing:
soo Chris, who is your fave lostie??

[casspat123]

season 5 is gonna be so exciting. i can't wait to see it. the whole island disappearing was freaky and i wonder what the people on the island were thinking.

i'm new to this as well, so yea. sorry if i'm not in the loop right away cuz i just joined. i will try and catch up if possible. :)

[chicagoaudra]

I really am having major Lost withdrawal. I need season 5!

[sumita]

Season 4 is interesting one....I love to watch the 4th season this Season is Great....I saw this Season Last week......