San Francisco Bans Plastic Bags

Jon · 07-25-2007, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by San Francisco Chronicle Newspaper

San Francisco's Board of Supervisors voted 10-1 this afternoon to make the city the first in the nation to prohibit petroleum-based plastic checkout bags in large markets and pharmacies.

On the first of two votes needed for final passage, supervisors approved legislation sponsored by Supervisor Ross Mirkarimi that would mandate the use of biodegradable plastic bags or recyclable paper bags. The legislation would take effect in about six months for some 50 large markets in San Francisco and would apply in about 12 months to large drugstore chains such as Walgreen's and Rite-Aid.

"Hopefully, other cities and states will follow suit," said Mirkarimi.

Mirkarimi introduced his legislation earlier this year after the collapse of an agreement between the California Grocers Association and the city. That agreement was supposed to reduce by 10 million the estimated 180 million plastic bags distributed to shoppers in 2006. The grocers association said it cut use of the bags by 7.6 million but the city said those figures were unreliable.

Aside from the petroleum required to manufacture them, plastic bags are blamed for gumming up recycling machines, taking up space in landfills and killing or sickening marine mammals.

The grocers association argues that it already has plastic bag recycling centers operating in many large markets and that new compostable bags could confuse recycling efforts.

Supervisor Ed Jew, who said he has heard from constituents wondering why supervisors have spent so much time on the issue of plastic bags, was the only member to vote against the legislation.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...AG1ROSLSG4.DTL

This started in March, but I figured it was time to post a thread on it because one day other liberal cities may follow suit. Now this may seem like it's nothing to many of you, but try going to a CostCo or say Circuit City and then not having a bag to put your stuff in. I do a lot of shopping and it's a pain to not have bags to put stuff in. I recently bought a bunch of items from Circuit City and they brought me a garbage bag, lucikly a worker said a garbage bag would work. I mean give me a break, stopping grocery stores from using plastic bags will really do nothing to fix any of the so-called "problems" that are pointed out due to the use of plastic bags. Yes, less petroleum will be used for plastic bags, but it'll be used nonetheless for many other things. stopping the production of plastic bags isn't going to stop or lessen the use of petroleum. Plastic bags are blamed for gumming up recycling machines? Wow...so people are ACTUALLY recycling and doing their part to try and "save" the environment but nope of course it's still a problem. Taking up space in landfills? So again stopping the use of plastic bags will create tons of space in landfills? Any space not used by plastic bags will be used by something else. The marine animals reason I can actually believe, but that's due to idiots and careless people. Most people aren't trying to dump plastic bags into the ocean.

Once you start shopping and checking-out without plastic bags, one will realize how much we miss them. Trust me, I already do.

If I could, I'd vote for Ed Jew in every election possible. I agree with his constituents, with terrorism, social security, people's health and safety, and other important topics looming on the horizon, San Francisco Supervisors choose to target plastic bags. :clap clap:

oclover24 · 07-25-2007, 10:24 PM

I always use paper ones at the grocery store...

Jon · 07-25-2007, 10:35 PM

Well I do too now. But the problem with the paper ones are that they added handles, but they break off so easily. It's not always easy to lug things home in paper bags, especially say a huge watermelon.

Now try buying some wet items like orange juice or ice cream. The condensation on them wets the paper to the point where the bags don't feel safe.

My belief is banning plastic bags will do nothing to fix the problems they believe are caused by plastic bags.

Heather · 07-26-2007, 06:10 AM

Personally, I always used both.

Jon · 07-26-2007, 01:29 PM

I do too. For me, they both have their advantages and dis-advantages. I just don't think only having one or the other is enough. I jsut like having a choice.

BellaBlack · 07-26-2007, 07:52 PM

I believe I always used both as well but eh if paper bags are out I don't really care. The crinkly noise always annoyed me..

Jon · 07-26-2007, 08:12 PM

My issue is, nobody will understand how weird and difficult it is to not have plastic bags at grocery stores till they're gone. I would not mind one bit if we didn't waste plastic bags and whatnot, but they're important to us for carrying groceries and other items.

oclover24 · 07-26-2007, 08:42 PM

Not to sound all hippy-dippy and enviroment-freakish, but you could always bring your own cloth bags to the store. I would do that if they banned plastic bags here.

Kristen · 07-26-2007, 08:44 PM

i have never used paper bags always use plastic and i put them in a cabinet thing after grocery shopping if we need them at all

Jon · 07-26-2007, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kristen

i have never used paper bags always use plastic and i put them in a cabinet thing after grocery shopping if we need them at all

Well we do use paper bags also, but the plastic bags we bring back home, goes into a container for future use. I don't just throw away plastic bags, I try to always re-use them. Unless obviously it's like dirty ot torn.

Webeh · 07-26-2007, 10:37 PM

I know a lot of grocery also offer the services of returning the plastic bags to the store for recycling. That's what I do if I have too many to reuse myself.

I'll admit that I do rely on plastic bags a lot when grocery shopping. Especially when you buy a lot of stuff. It makes it easier to carry everything and some stuff you just don't want to put into your own bag (AKA. raw meat).

Even though I do believe it's great that an effort is being made to reduce the harm done to the environment. I also think practicality matters in this issue too. If it's harder to carry things home, people will buy less. Buying less could possibly equal more trips to the grocery store and if you live a long distance, this means more vehicle fumes released into the environment. Public transport and privately own cars would have to accomodate to that.

Maybe it would be preferable if more attempts were made to just cut back. If you're only buying a few small items, you don't necessarily need a plastic or any bag at all.

Jon · 07-26-2007, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Webeh

I know a lot of grocery also offer the services of returning the plastic bags to the store for recycling. That's what I do if I have too many to reuse myself.

I'll admit that I do rely on plastic bags a lot when grocery shopping. Especially when you buy a lot of stuff. It makes it easier to carry everything and some stuff you just don't want to put into your own bag (AKA. raw meat).

Even though I do believe it's great that an effort is being made to reduce the harm done to the environment. I also think practicality matters in this issue too. If it's harder to carry things home, people will buy less. Buying less could possibly equal more trips to the grocery store and if you live a long distance, this means more vehicle fumes released into the environment. Public transport and privately own cars would have to accomodate to that.

Maybe it would be preferable if more attempts were made to just cut back. If you're only buying a few small items, you don't necessarily need a plastic or any bag at all.

You said it perfectly. It's fine if the city wants to help the environment, but I truly believe they went overboard. There are things you simply don't want to use paper bags for. Same goes with cloth bags. If you have raw meat like Webeh suggested, do you really want that going into a cloth bag? I know some people put the raw meat into a clear plastic bag first, but even then sometimes blood or liquid leaks out. if that happens your cloth bag is pretty much ruined. You can try cleaning it, but those bags aren't designed to go through a washing machine too easily. As I said, I don't mind conservation and using less plastic bags, and of course recycling is good too. But banning bags is a step that went too far. Unless a real solution is in place instead of plastic bags, I think they should have waited. Banning plastic bags without an alternate solution is not smart in my opinion.

WisteriaJ7 · 08-20-2007, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon

Unless a real solution is in place instead of plastic bags, I think they should have waited. Banning plastic bags without an alternate solution is not smart in my opinion.

That's exactly what I was thinking after reading that article. The city should have come up with a good alternative solution before banning plastic bags. I think that most of their reasoning is lame. Personally, I prefer plastic bags for most items. As well, I reuse them a lot. It would be very difficult to not be able to use them.

Ashlyn · 08-25-2007, 11:45 AM

I know a lot of people who just bring cloth bags to the stores, like Christine suggested, even here where we don't even have the choice of paper bags at most stores. Or you could just bring plastic bags from home, if you have some of those saved up and prefer them.

I'm of the mentality that every little bit helps, so... banning plastic bags, why not?

Diva_Web · 09-06-2007, 04:36 PM

I agree about being conservative. I have fabric bags; use, reuse and recycle plastic, and sometimes get paper bags, which I also reuse until they fall apart.

Like someone else said, sometimes you really need the plastic, like for things that can be wet (like milk) or juice out, like meat products.

I have two big insulated bags that I got from Sam's, and I carry those with me, but for meats that can leak out, I still like them in a plastic bag to keep things sanitary.

07-25-2007, 10:24 PM	#2 (permalink)
oclover24 Hollywood Star Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Icons from reina_jpn on livejournal! Posts: 8,596	I always use paper ones at the grocery store... Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ you know you love me...

07-25-2007, 10:35 PM	#3 (permalink)
Jon Agent Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Orange County Posts: 8,338	Well I do too now. But the problem with the paper ones are that they added handles, but they break off so easily. It's not always easy to lug things home in paper bags, especially say a huge watermelon. Now try buying some wet items like orange juice or ice cream. The condensation on them wets the paper to the point where the bags don't feel safe. My belief is banning plastic bags will do nothing to fix the problems they believe are caused by plastic bags. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________

07-26-2007, 06:10 AM	#4 (permalink)
Heather Political Junkie Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: In fields of gold Posts: 19,202	Personally, I always used both. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ And so the lion fell in love with the lamb. -What a stupid lamb -What a sick, masochistic lion -Edward and Bella

07-26-2007, 01:29 PM	#5 (permalink)
Jon Agent Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Orange County Posts: 8,338	I do too. For me, they both have their advantages and dis-advantages. I just don't think only having one or the other is enough. I jsut like having a choice. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________

07-26-2007, 07:52 PM	#6 (permalink)
BellaBlack Hollywood Elite Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: credit to ajcher for the sig Posts: 35,228	I believe I always used both as well but eh if paper bags are out I don't really care. The crinkly noise always annoyed me.. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ *The time has come*

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07-26-2007, 08:12 PM	#7 (permalink)
Jon Agent Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Orange County Posts: 8,338	My issue is, nobody will understand how weird and difficult it is to not have plastic bags at grocery stores till they're gone. I would not mind one bit if we didn't waste plastic bags and whatnot, but they're important to us for carrying groceries and other items. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________

07-26-2007, 08:42 PM	#8 (permalink)
oclover24 Hollywood Star Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Icons from reina_jpn on livejournal! Posts: 8,596	Not to sound all hippy-dippy and enviroment-freakish, but you could always bring your own cloth bags to the store. I would do that if they banned plastic bags here. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ you know you love me...

07-26-2007, 08:44 PM	#9 (permalink)
Kristen Agent Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: miles from normal; MA Posts: 21,475	i have never used paper bags always use plastic and i put them in a cabinet thing after grocery shopping if we need them at all Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ Voted Biggest Joy & James Fan \| ♥ \| there's only one, tree hill. M.I.A-ish, College icons by me - locketdesigns @ LJ

07-26-2007, 10:37 PM	#11 (permalink)
Webeh Prime-Time Actor Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 3,008	I know a lot of grocery also offer the services of returning the plastic bags to the store for recycling. That's what I do if I have too many to reuse myself. I'll admit that I do rely on plastic bags a lot when grocery shopping. Especially when you buy a lot of stuff. It makes it easier to carry everything and some stuff you just don't want to put into your own bag (AKA. raw meat). Even though I do believe it's great that an effort is being made to reduce the harm done to the environment. I also think practicality matters in this issue too. If it's harder to carry things home, people will buy less. Buying less could possibly equal more trips to the grocery store and if you live a long distance, this means more vehicle fumes released into the environment. Public transport and privately own cars would have to accomodate to that. Maybe it would be preferable if more attempts were made to just cut back. If you're only buying a few small items, you don't necessarily need a plastic or any bag at all. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________

08-25-2007, 11:45 AM	#14 (permalink)
Ashlyn 32 Flavors and then some Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: av credit: Kay Posts: 12,519	I know a lot of people who just bring cloth bags to the stores, like Christine suggested, even here where we don't even have the choice of paper bags at most stores. Or you could just bring plastic bags from home, if you have some of those saved up and prefer them. I'm of the mentality that every little bit helps, so... banning plastic bags, why not? Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter! __________________ Credit: Theresa -- Visit the Friday Night Lights Board!

09-06-2007, 04:36 PM	#15 (permalink)
Diva_Web Groupie Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 11	I agree about being conservative. I have fabric bags; use, reuse and recycle plastic, and sometimes get paper bags, which I also reuse until they fall apart. Like someone else said, sometimes you really need the plastic, like for things that can be wet (like milk) or juice out, like meat products. I have two big insulated bags that I got from Sam's, and I carry those with me, but for meats that can leak out, I still like them in a plastic bag to keep things sanitary. Share Share this post on Digg Del.icio.us Technorati Twitter!